Flower identification

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 04 Aug 2013, 17:43

Anyone up for "Name That Bullet!"?

Don't really care about the caliber, looking for bullet name/manufacturer. Understanding that more than one company may use "Bullet B".

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 04 Aug 2013, 19:05

speer gold dots.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 05 Aug 2013, 05:23

Buffman wrote:speer gold dots.

Bingo!

Anything stand out as unique for the SGD bullet, Buffman?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 05 Aug 2013, 05:25

Another one:

Hobknob · Post by **Hobknob** » 05 Aug 2013, 11:16

Barnes TAC XP

flyingirish04 · Post by **flyingirish04** » 05 Aug 2013, 13:29

Missing the best though.

Post by **blueorison** » 05 Aug 2013, 14:40

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 05 Aug 2013, 16:34

^^^ That's HST. Note the missing prongs on the end of the copper jacket.

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 05 Aug 2013, 16:35

fd57 wrote:Another one:

Barnes TAC-XP bullet. Could be from DoubleTap, Corbon, or the likes. It would not be from Barnes, as their own loadings have a black coating on the bullet

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 05 Aug 2013, 16:38

fd57 wrote:
Buffman wrote:speer gold dots.
Bingo!

Anything stand out as unique for the SGD bullet, Buffman?

It appears to look like it came from a standard Speer loading. Generally when loaded in other manufacturers (Underwood) there's going to be pretty extreme penetration.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 05 Aug 2013, 18:50

flyingirish04 wrote:Missing the best though.

A solid performer, Federal Tactical HST.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 05 Aug 2013, 18:54

Hobknob wrote:Barnes TAC XP

Yup - Barnes XPB 180gr in .41magnum. Loaded by Cor-Bon in their DPX line.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 05 Aug 2013, 18:59

Buffman wrote: Barnes TAC-XP bullet. Could be from DoubleTap, Corbon, or the likes. It would not be from Barnes, as their own loadings have a black coating on the bullet

I haven't seen the black coating on their 180gr .41magnum bullets, Buffman. I'll upload some snaps soon to show you. What caliber or which calibers have you seen the black coating on?

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 05 Aug 2013, 19:05

TAC-XPD .380, 9mm, .40, .45

Hobknob · Post by **Hobknob** » 05 Aug 2013, 19:54

The three on the left half already been ID'd, but how about the the two on the right

They will be an immediate ID if you've ever stumbled across them before:

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 06 Aug 2013, 05:20

Hobknob wrote:The three on the left half already been ID'd, but how about the the two on the right
They will be an immediate ID if you've ever stumbled across them before:

Those four petal bullets are from Lehigh Defense, their maximum expansion bullets.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 06 Aug 2013, 05:30

Buffman wrote:TAC-XPD .380, 9mm, .40, .45

I think the difference is the TAC-XPD vs. VOR-TX ammo. Their personal defense ammo has the black coating applied while the handgun hunting ammo does not.

flyingirish04 · Post by **flyingirish04** » 06 Aug 2013, 06:57

fd57 wrote:
Hobknob wrote:The three on the left half already been ID'd, but how about the the two on the right
They will be an immediate ID if you've ever stumbled across them before:

Those four petal bullets are from Lehigh Defense, their maximum expansion bullets.

I would still rather have the HSTs. they will expand like that in soft tissue. Lehighs don't always. Still pretty cool design to get that type of expansion in water.

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 06 Aug 2013, 07:52

Grizzly Xtreme has copper rounds like that. Or does Grizzly get them from Lehigh Defense?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 06 Aug 2013, 12:16

Switching gears ... anyone recognize this one:

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 06 Aug 2013, 14:23

Winchester Silvertip?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 06 Aug 2013, 15:29

Buffman wrote:Winchester Silvertip?

Negative.

As a hint: the caliber is .308 and pay attention to the bottom of the bullet in the one snap as there is a very unique mark.

500SWfan · Post by **500SWfan** » 06 Aug 2013, 18:19

fd57 wrote:Switching gears ... anyone recognize this one:

Federal Trophy Bonded Tip?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 06 Aug 2013, 18:43

500SWfan wrote:
fd57 wrote: Federal Trophy Bonded Tip?

Wow - very close! Not Federal TROPHY Bonded Tip, but it is Federal TACTICAL Bonded Tip.

But I will give it to you because the bullet is almost identical, the only differences are the tips and the weight (Trophy is 165gr and Tactical is 168gr). Of course in a court of law or the scientific community I would have to say "no soup for you!". LOL

This is actually a fantastic round. It penetrates and really stays true.

Can we know how you came to your answer of Trophy Bonded Tip?

500SWfan · Post by **500SWfan** » 06 Aug 2013, 18:49

The "T" on the base of the bullet reminded me of the Trophy Bonded Tip, and I knew they were nickel plated. I haven't run across the Tactical Bonded Tip.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 06 Aug 2013, 19:05

500SWfan wrote:The "T" on the base of the bullet reminded me of the Trophy Bonded Tip, and I knew they were nickel plated. I haven't run across the Tactical Bonded Tip.

Yeah the "T" is a unique identifier for sure. Putting the projectiles though auto glass while keeping centered is easy. These really stay true. I understand the 165gr trophy hunting variety is a knock down round.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 06 Aug 2013, 19:07

Anyone?

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 06 Aug 2013, 21:49

golden saber?

flyingirish04 · Post by **flyingirish04** » 06 Aug 2013, 22:29

:agree: That was my guess with its terrible expansion rate.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 07 Aug 2013, 05:00

Buffman wrote:golden saber?

ARGH Buffman! These are your Winchester Silvertips! Thought I'd throw 'em up since you guessed them earlier

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 07 Aug 2013, 05:12

Another go around:

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 07 Aug 2013, 06:50

Ranger T, SXT?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 07 Aug 2013, 07:16

Buffman wrote:Ranger T, SXT?

Nah. But you're in the right family (Winchester).

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 07 Aug 2013, 08:04

PDX1?

Vortec MAX · Post by **Vortec MAX** » 07 Aug 2013, 09:22

I would have guessed "T" series too. It is the same as the old "Black Talon" bullet but without the black coating.

Mike

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 07 Aug 2013, 12:04

Not a T series variant of Ranger or PDX1.

They are Winchester's 240gr platinum tip hollow point (PTHP) bullets. They sport a notched reversed tapered jacket with a 2-part hollow point cavity. Great for black bear, boar, mule deer, etc..

Post by **panzermk2** » 07 Aug 2013, 22:35

Post by **jmz5** » 08 Aug 2013, 04:10

panzermk2 wrote:

http://montanagoldbullet.com/index.php/ ... r-jhp.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Hobknob · Post by **Hobknob** » 08 Aug 2013, 13:51

Some easy, some hard :-)

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 08 Aug 2013, 17:30

Hobknob wrote:

Some easy, some hard :-)

You have larger photos to help view the bullets?

The second from the left appears to be a Hornady bullet (red plug).

Hobknob · Post by **Hobknob** » 08 Aug 2013, 18:53

fd57 wrote:
Hobknob wrote:

Some easy, some hard :-)
You have larger photos to help view the bullets?

The second from the left appears to be a Hornady bullet (red plug).

Correct, the second is a Hornady Critical Defense.

For reference, these were tests that I pulled the best and worst of each type during a test.

Sorry about the crappy pics, I lost the original crappy cell phone pics, and these were ones I had texted to a friend, so they're a bit degraded. Here is slightly bigger.

Here's another angle:

Post by **panzermk2** » 08 Aug 2013, 19:01

jmz5 wrote:
panzermk2 wrote:

http://montanagoldbullet.com/index.php/ ... r-jhp.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

LOL as a liker of 10mm and forum owner you have seen those pics already.

Post by **Rapier1772** » 08 Aug 2013, 19:25

Hobknob wrote:

Some easy, some hard :-)

Left one Starfire?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 08 Aug 2013, 19:39

Hobknob wrote:

Some easy, some hard :-)

So we said the second was Hornady.

The first is PMC Starfire?

The third is Speer?

The fourth is Winchester?

Hobknob · Post by **Hobknob** » 08 Aug 2013, 22:09

fd57 wrote:
Hobknob wrote:

Some easy, some hard :-)
So we said the second was Hornady.

The first is PMC Starfire?

The third is Speer?

The fourth is Winchester?

Bingo.
PMC Starfire, Hornady Critical Duty, Speer Gold Dot, Winchester Ranger Bonded

Post by **jmz5** » 09 Aug 2013, 03:43

panzermk2 wrote:
jmz5 wrote:
panzermk2 wrote:

http://montanagoldbullet.com/index.php/ ... r-jhp.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

LOL as a liker of 10mm and forum owner you have seen those pics already.

Yes I have! :laugh:

Post by **jmz5** » 09 Aug 2013, 03:45

This game is fun.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 09 Aug 2013, 05:40

Hobknob wrote:
fd57 wrote:
Hobknob wrote:

Some easy, some hard :-)
So we said the second was Hornady.

The first is PMC Starfire?

The third is Speer?

The fourth is Winchester?
Bingo.
PMC Starfire, Hornady Critical Duty, Speer Gold Dot, Winchester Ranger Bonded

I found it difficult to identify the bullets based on the flowered bullets themselves. Be it the angle or the size no matter. Just was difficult. Especially the blob that was the Ranger. LOL

Honestly had you had just the flowered bullets I might have batted 500.

By including a loaded round you made it much easier, although still not easy. The red plug was easy to ID as Hornady (although you could have added a red plug to a different round to mess with folks!). The flower for Starfire is unique but the bullet mouth really identified that one, as did the Winchester. You can look at that last round and just immediately know it is a Winchester Ranger bullet based on the mouth and the thickness of the jacket.

Thanks for uploading!

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 09 Aug 2013, 05:48

Another one:

Hobknob · Post by **Hobknob** » 09 Aug 2013, 20:50

fd57 wrote:
Hobknob wrote:
fd57 wrote:
Hobknob wrote: Some easy, some hard :-)
So we said the second was Hornady.

The first is PMC Starfire?

The third is Speer?

The fourth is Winchester?
Bingo.
PMC Starfire, Hornady Critical Duty, Speer Gold Dot, Winchester Ranger Bonded

I found it difficult to identify the bullets based on the flowered bullets themselves. Be it the angle or the size no matter. Just was difficult. Especially the blob that was the Ranger. LOL

Honestly had you had just the flowered bullets I might have batted 500.

By including a loaded round you made it much easier, although still not easy. The red plug was easy to ID as Hornady (although you could have added a red plug to a different round to mess with folks!). The flower for Starfire is unique but the bullet mouth really identified that one, as did the Winchester. You can look at that last round and just immediately know it is a Winchester Ranger bullet based on the mouth and the thickness of the jacket.

Thanks for uploading!

Glad to help out

It's a fun game.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 14 Aug 2013, 12:32

fd57 wrote:Another one:

Okay this one is Hornady's XTP bullet (210gr .41magnum). You can identify XTP bullets by the blob, and how often the blob looks like an old bandage in the "x" shape (overlapping).

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 14 Aug 2013, 12:33

A new one. Let's see how long it takes for someone to quickly ID these:

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 15 Aug 2013, 19:29

fd57 wrote:A new one. Let's see how long it takes for someone to quickly ID these:

Well I thought these would be a quick ID given that they are the SS192, SS195, and SS198 bullets. Where are the (re)loaders?!?!

500SWfan · Post by **500SWfan** » 15 Aug 2013, 19:44

I knew they were .224 cal. I didn't recognize the open base though, 'cause I haven't pulled the bullets on any of those rounds (yet).

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 15 Aug 2013, 20:17

500SWfan wrote:I knew they were .224 cal. I didn't recognize the open base though, 'cause I haven't pulled the bullets on any of those rounds (yet).

These were SS192 shot in the pond.

Post by **jmz5** » 16 Aug 2013, 05:01

fd57 wrote: Well I thought these would be a quick ID given that they are the SS192, SS195, and SS198 bullets. Where are the (re)loaders?!?!

I don't waste good ammo to make new ammo. :p

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 16 Aug 2013, 07:50

jmz5 wrote:
fd57 wrote: Well I thought these would be a quick ID given that they are the SS192, SS195, and SS198 bullets. Where are the (re)loaders?!?!
I don't waste good ammo to make new ammo. :p

The only good ammo is ammo that spirals out from a barrel

Test everything here. Into water (a lot of the spent bullets become jewelry), cars, household appliances (fridge, washing machine, etc.), clay, etc. Figure you have to cycle at least 50 rounds of any load for testing purposes.

But given the loaders and the Fn/FSN focus, I did think these would be identified right quick. Someone here has pulled SS192/5/8 if not to load then at least for curiosity. LOL

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 16 Aug 2013, 07:58

To help with this one, it is a .308 round:

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 18 Aug 2013, 06:16

fd57 wrote:To help with this one, it is a .308 round:

This is Federal's Tactical TRU in 165gr. You can expect this fragmentation as per its design to penetrate but not over penetrate.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 18 Aug 2013, 18:39

Anyone? Bueller?

Post by **jmz5** » 19 Aug 2013, 03:50

No idea on those two.

Post by **jmz5** » 19 Aug 2013, 03:54

fd57 wrote:Anyone? Bueller?

Oh wait, maybe I do have an idea, is that Barnes tac-xp?

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 19 Aug 2013, 06:22

definitely not Barnes. At least from all the recovered Barnes I've seen. Those petals ^ are fatter than barnes and there's some lines on the petals... HMM

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 19 Aug 2013, 08:26

Yes these most recent ones are not Barnes. Two unique characteristics of these are the lines as Buffman pointed out as well as the "lips" (trough) at the petal end. The petals almost look like a scoop.

flyingirish04 · Post by **flyingirish04** » 19 Aug 2013, 08:55

Corbon Powerball or DPX?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 19 Aug 2013, 10:38

flyingirish04 wrote:Corbon Powerball or DPX?

Negative. But appreciate the interest and post.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 19 Aug 2013, 10:41

HINT: Newer bullet (IE, has only been around for a short while).

fd57 wrote:Anyone? Bueller?

500SWfan · Post by **500SWfan** » 19 Aug 2013, 20:16

fd57 wrote:HINT: Newer bullet (IE, has only been around for a short while).

fd57 wrote:Anyone? Bueller?

That's not a Cutting Edge bullet, is it?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 20 Aug 2013, 05:27

500SWfan wrote: That's not a Cutting Edge bullet, is it?

Nah, not a Cutting Edge bullet. Those look very different than these.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 20 Aug 2013, 05:31

Okay, to give up the goose, these are the C.O.P. bullets in 9mm. The Copper Only Projectiles bullet. The lines and the trough like petals are fairly unique to C.O.P. bullets.

fd57 wrote:Anyone? Bueller?

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 22 Aug 2013, 07:58

These should be a quick ID:

Buffman · Post by **Buffman** » 22 Aug 2013, 10:04

AE 5.7 TMJ

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 22 Aug 2013, 13:25

Buffman wrote:AE 5.7 TMJ

DING DING DING We've got a winner! Buffman strikes again!

Maybe we should have prizes ...

These are Federal American Eagle 5.7x28 bullets fished from the pond.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 10 Sep 2013, 05:28

Here's one:

Post by **panzermk2** » 10 Sep 2013, 10:11

Barnes TSX

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 10 Sep 2013, 15:54

panzermk2 wrote:Barnes TSX

Close, but no cigar. These aren't Barnes TSX.

Now that said, the answer should come quick enough

Hobknob · Post by **Hobknob** » 10 Sep 2013, 21:29

fd57 wrote:
panzermk2 wrote:Barnes TSX
Close, but no cigar. These aren't Barnes TSX.

Now that said, the answer should come quick enough

How about the MRX?

Though they don't make them anymore, the bottom looks similar as does the fact that the copper stops at a metplat of sorts.

The LRX is another one that is possible.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 11 Sep 2013, 05:06

Hobknob wrote:
fd57 wrote:
panzermk2 wrote:Barnes TSX
Close, but no cigar. These aren't Barnes TSX.

Now that said, the answer should come quick enough
How about the MRX?

Though they don't make them anymore, the bottom looks similar as does the fact that the copper stops at a metplat of sorts.

The LRX is another one that is possible.

Bingo - winner. MRX! 180gr MRX by Barnes.

The MRX is a sweet bullet. The silvex core (instead of lead) allowed for deep penetration and a shorter bullet (compared to TSX).

Hobknob · Post by **Hobknob** » 11 Sep 2013, 09:54

fd57 wrote:
Hobknob wrote:
fd57 wrote:
panzermk2 wrote:Barnes TSX
Close, but no cigar. These aren't Barnes TSX.

Now that said, the answer should come quick enough
How about the MRX?

Though they don't make them anymore, the bottom looks similar as does the fact that the copper stops at a metplat of sorts.

The LRX is another one that is possible.
Bingo - winner. MRX! 180gr MRX by Barnes.

The MRX is a sweet bullet. The silvex core (instead of lead) allowed for deep penetration and a shorter bullet (compared to TSX).

Yea, I'm a big fan of the MRX, just not a fan of the price tag associated with them

The Silvex core was a tungsten based material if I remember right, making it heavier than lead.
I only have a couple of boxes left of them, so I've been using them even more sparingly than before.

Thanks for putting those pics up, it's kind of neat to see what bullets other folks are pushing!

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 11 Sep 2013, 11:43

Hobknob wrote: Yea, I'm a big fan of the MRX, just not a fan of the price tag associated with them
The Silvex core was a tungsten based material if I remember right, making it heavier than lead.
I only have a couple of boxes left of them, so I've been using them even more sparingly than before.

Thanks for putting those pics up, it's kind of neat to see what bullets other folks are pushing!

There's not an animal in North America that wouldn't fall by this 180gr MRX bullet.

You're right - their "silvex" was/is tungsten like and more dense, so the bullet was heavier than lead filled and could be shorter which allows for more powder.

On the Barnes blog/announcement area back before 2012 they announced no longer making the MRX. Lots of flack and questions why, speculation about the terminal ballistics capability (IE this projectile penetrates through and through), etc. Ultimately a Barnes rep responded that it was because of the price tag - past couple of years (leading up to 2012) more sales for TSX and less for MRX so Barnes decided to abandon MRX.

If you can find the loaded Vital Shok with the MRX bullet it's a great investment. Same for the remaining boxes of bullets. They're out there, just have to look.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 12 Sep 2013, 08:13

Any guesses?

Mister Freeze · Post by **Mister Freeze** » 12 Sep 2013, 12:39

Black Talon

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 12 Sep 2013, 12:48

Mister Freeze wrote:Black Talon

No dice on the Black Talon but thanks for playing

I will provide a tip - these are Winchester ...

Mister Freeze · Post by **Mister Freeze** » 12 Sep 2013, 14:36

Ranger SXT

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 13 Sep 2013, 04:44

Mister Freeze wrote:Ranger SXT

No dice on the Ranger SXT. Answer soon to follow.

fd57 · Post by **fd57** » 13 Sep 2013, 04:46

These are Winchester's Platinum Tip Hollow Point bullets. Shown here in .454 Casull. You can almost always link the sharp petals back to Winchester, and then the horseshoe shape of the petals back to the PTHP in large bore.

fd57 wrote:Any guesses?

Post by **panzermk2** » 25 Sep 2013, 09:58

Can I play? It's about 4 inches deep.

grimmond · Post by **grimmond** » 25 Sep 2013, 17:02

Jay what 5.7 round will I not find in that 4" deep pile? I think that would be the harder question.

Post by **Rapier1772** » 25 Sep 2013, 17:12

I know one round you won't find in there, Greenberg's Tactical Incendiary Tracking Seeking Neutralizing Ammunition (for) Selective Suppression. They basically disintegrate/vaporize on impact.

Not saying it wasn't tested, just that you won't be able to prove it :monkey:

Post by **panzermk2** » 25 Sep 2013, 21:50

grimmond wrote:Jay what 5.7 round will I not find in that 4" deep pile? I think that would be the harder question.

Every single 22 cal bullet from ANY available source including over seas manufactured under 72gr. Literally including older 22 hornet/bee/jet etc. discontinued bullets from decades ago.

Also every 9mm, 40, 44, and 45 from Montana Gold bullet, Federal, CCI and Hornady.

Plus some I have forgotten about.

Website · Post by **jgreenberg01** » 26 Sep 2013, 05:28

Rapier1772 wrote:I know one round you won't find in there, Greenberg's Tactical Incendiary Tracking Seeking Neutralizing Ammunition (for) Selective Suppression. They basically disintegrate/vaporize on impact.

Not saying it wasn't tested, just that you won't be able to prove it :monkey:

Haha, I'm glad someone remembers that round!

I want to do a Part Deux video, but I lost access to the private land that I can blow stuff up at. Sooner or later, the round will be like Ahnold though: back.

Iberliner2027 · Post by **Iberliner2027** » 27 Sep 2013, 11:47

Rapier1772 wrote:I know one round you won't find in there, Greenberg's Tactical Incendiary Tracking Seeking Neutralizing Ammunition (for) Selective Suppression. They basically disintegrate/vaporize on impact.

Not saying it wasn't tested, just that you won't be able to prove it :monkey:

So, I read that and was like, "Wow, that's a long name for a rou....really dude that spells out... -_- "

I think I just self-nominated for the n00b award

Post by **Rapier1772** » 27 Sep 2013, 17:49

Iberliner2027 wrote:
Rapier1772 wrote:I know one round you won't find in there, Greenberg's Tactical Incendiary Tracking Seeking Neutralizing Ammunition (for) Selective Suppression. They basically disintegrate/vaporize on impact.
Not saying it wasn't tested, just that you won't be able to prove it :monkey:
So, I read that and was like, "Wow, that's a long name for a rou....really dude that spells out... -_- "
I think I just self-nominated for the n00b award

:lmao: Not to worry, we'll corrupt you soon enough

Website · Post by **jgreenberg01** » 28 Sep 2013, 04:19

One more time for the noobs...

Post by **Rapier1772** » 28 Sep 2013, 05:45

Last time you posted that vid, it got the thread caged.

MikeSantor wrote:You guys really thought this was going to stay civil in the open forum? We have the maturity level of a 16 year old here. That level drops to 14 If I post in the thread...

So I'll warn y'all now - I'll delete any comments which would do that to this thread.
Public forum, keep it safe for work & kids.

Iberliner2027 · Post by **Iberliner2027** » 28 Sep 2013, 07:11

Definitely worth a chuckle. Gotta spread the word to all the Speerwinremady enthusiasts I know and let em know they're now obsolete...

I personally carry Critical Defense in 40, cuz I can't afford the $26 a round this premium Tactical Incendiary Tracking stuff costs =P

Website · Post by **jgreenberg01** » 28 Sep 2013, 08:35

Rapier1772 wrote:Last time you posted that vid, it got the thread caged.
MikeSantor wrote:You guys really thought this was going to stay civil in the open forum? We have the maturity level of a 16 year old here. That level drops to 14 If I post in the thread...
So I'll warn y'all now - I'll delete any comments which would do that to this thread.
Public forum, keep it safe for work & kids.

Haven't we grown as adults since then though?

Post by **Rapier1772** » 28 Sep 2013, 09:02

Not from what I've seen :p

Who is online