FN SPR

Discuss the FN bolt action rifle lineup; the Patrol Bolt Rifle (PBR), Special Police Rifle (SPR), Tactical Sport Rifle (TSR), and Ballista.
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flyingirish04
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FN SPR

Post by flyingirish04 » 06 May 2013, 10:07

Had a chance to really work out an FN SPR A5M with a 20" fluted bbl. I have to say, rifle was set up just like I like it. McMillian A5 stock felt just like my custom guns. FN has done a bit of tuning to the Mod 70 action and bolt they chose. Gun shoots well, groups under 1" consistently with cheap corelok Remington 140 grainers. Loaded some handloads with 175 SMKs, and it shot in fives consistently. Good little rifle...until I was told price.

So I can get one for very heavily discounted for around $2400, shops locally are quoting guys $2850!

I have to say I don't understand it. I could build a semi-custom of a Mod 70 or Rem 700 for at least a 1000 less that retail price with same kit, and better barrel.


Shot a Savage 308 that was 1900 bucks less, shot just as tight. Kinda scratching my head on what FN is thinking.
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srt-4_jon
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Re: FN SPR

Post by srt-4_jon » 06 May 2013, 17:57

You are missing the point of the spr.

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Re: FN SPR

Post by flyingirish04 » 06 May 2013, 19:13

What exactly am I missing? :facepalm:

Anyway if you want one, I know a guy that can get you into one for less than retail. Way less. And I won't judge you...much ;)
Killed Two Stones with One Bird.

srt-4_jon
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Re: FN SPR

Post by srt-4_jon » 07 May 2013, 02:56

The fact that you have a 100% reliable gun that will hold It's accuracy past 10k rounds. With the massive claw extractor, you won't ever have to worry about not being able to get brass out..You also never need to worry about the brass not clearing the ejection port. I am a huge savage fan but I haven't had a single one that hasn't had the accutrigger malfunction on me while shooting. The bolt lift also sucks something fierce. A TRG won't keep up with a custom *insert whatever here" when shooting bugholes at 1500yds either. it isn't the point of that rifle either

Out of curiosity, what new $500 Savage were you shooting that kept up with the FN at distance?

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Re: FN SPR

Post by flyingirish04 » 07 May 2013, 16:09

Listen, I know you like the gun, but you aren't even playing on the same field here. The Mod70 variant action isn't utilized really at all by LE/MIL. I will say Gunny Hathcock way back in 'Nam used a great pre-64 Mod 70 in 30.06. But back then USMC Sniper course was an in country 3 week course, and through the years everything has changed, including the firearm.

Not to mention the type of gun you are talking about is available in a variety of options and methods for less than the FN. And don't take my word for it, take the market's word.

A few items for your consideration:

The positive feed and claw extractor on the Mod 70 is theoretically less prone to misfeeds, in reality, numerous shooter will tell you that isn't the case. Not to mention the catastrophic failure situation where a Mod70 is less safe as the case has less metal around it than other actions, due to the large claw extractor.

But the biggest indicator of how far off FN is this: Of all the marksman units I have been around, almost all use some variant built off of a Rem700, with a custom bbl. The rest mostly have full custom actions (all rooted off Rem 700 including the Accuracy International platforms), except one that uses the 110 Savage rifle (they got to use their own rifles there), and another that used the Blaser 93 platform. Bear in mind those include City of Austin SWAT (Shout out to Blue), Escambia Co Sheriff, FL, Santa Rosa Co Sheriff, Flathead Co Sheriff, MT, Yellowstone Co Sheriff, MT, City of Portland SERT, Cass County Sheriff, ND, Burleigh Co Sheriff, ND, Williams Co SWAT, ND, MSP SRT, MN, and also FBI HRT, USSS, and I could go on. That doesn't even include every branch of the military, which uses Rem700 variant (or custom variant) for their mid distance BOLT gun. Some have started transitioning to autos like the OBR by Larue, or the SR-25 (Mk11 to the Navy) by KAC for their mid distance shooters, but bolt guns in 308 are almost always Rem700 derived actions. The tend to be most accurate, easiest to customize, true and blueprint. Have best variety of triggers, BMs, etc, etc. It is the gold standard for precision bolt guns.

And 10K is a stretch for any barrel in 308. Even a custom one like a Krieger, Lilja, or Bartlein. Put it this way, I doubt it's throat wouldn't be pretty scorched at 10K.

Mod 16 was the other rifle, and you are correct, it was $650 not $500 my apologies. Same difference.

Point is it's a nice rifle, but way overpriced. No need to go that route...unless you want an FN.

If it were $800 less, that is another story.
Killed Two Stones with One Bird.

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Re: FN SPR

Post by flyingirish04 » 07 May 2013, 16:09

Oh, and no gun is 100% reliable.
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srt-4_jon
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Re: FN SPR

Post by srt-4_jon » 10 May 2013, 06:43

flyingirish04 wrote:Listen, I know you like the gun, but you aren't even playing on the same field here. The Mod70 variant action isn't utilized really at all by LE/MIL. I will say Gunny Hathcock way back in 'Nam used a great pre-64 Mod 70 in 30.06. But back then USMC Sniper course was an in country 3 week course, and through the years everything has changed, including the firearm.Both of us are military and lets get serious. The mil bases decisions off of cost. The Beretta M9 is a perfect example. The newest assault rifle testing is another example.

Not to mention the type of gun you are talking about is available in a variety of options and methods for less than the FN. And don't take my word for it, take the market's word.

A few items for your consideration:

The positive feed and claw extractor on the Mod 70 is theoretically less prone to misfeeds, in reality, numerous shooter will tell you that isn't the case. Most african safari rifles use the M70 because of the CRF and claw extractor. Not to mention the catastrophic failure situation where a Mod70 is less safe as the case has less metal around it than other actions, due to the large claw extractor.So a little more gas leaks out where the extractor was?

But the biggest indicator of how far off FN is this: Of all the marksman units I have been around, almost all use some variant built off of a Rem700, with a custom bbl. The rest mostly have full custom actions (all rooted off Rem 700 including the Accuracy International platforms), except one that uses the 110 Savage rifle (they got to use their own rifles there), and another that used the Blaser 93 platform. Bear in mind those include City of Austin SWAT (Shout out to Blue), Escambia Co Sheriff, FL, Santa Rosa Co Sheriff, Flathead Co Sheriff, MT, Yellowstone Co Sheriff, MT, City of Portland SERT, Cass County Sheriff, ND, Burleigh Co Sheriff, ND, Williams Co SWAT, ND, MSP SRT, MN, and also FBI HRT, USSS, and I could go on. That doesn't even include every branch of the military, which uses Rem700 variant (or custom variant) for their mid distance BOLT gun. Some have started transitioning to autos like the OBR by Larue, or the SR-25 (Mk11 to the Navy) by KAC for their mid distance shooters, but bolt guns in 308 are almost always Rem700 derived actions. The tend to be most accurate, easiest to customize, true and blueprint. Have best variety of triggers, BMs, etc, etc. It is the gold standard for precision bolt guns.Many police agencies use Bushmaster ARs. Doesn't make them the best. I agree that the R700 action has WAY more options and gunsmiths that work on them.

And 10K is a stretch for any barrel in 308. Even a custom one like a Krieger, Lilja, or Bartlein. Put it this way, I doubt it's throat wouldn't be pretty scorched at 10K.None of those makers use a chrome lined barrel like FN

Mod 16 was the other rifle, and you are correct, it was $650 not $500 my apologies. Same difference. It really isnt the same difference. Did the model 16 come with a McMillian stock, quality DBM, heavy barrel? You are comparing the most expensive FN to one of the cheapest Savages. If FN made a gun with a plastic stock and pencil barrel, it would be significantly cheaper. You need to compare apples to apples.

Point is it's a nice rifle, but way overpriced. No need to go that route...unless you want an FN.You dont have to get the top of the line FN. The TSR can be had for much less. Heck, you can even get the SPR A1 for $1250 and that one comes with a McMillian stock. That puts it right in the same price range as the Savage 10 FCP with McMillian stock. Except with the FN, you get a 20MOA base, chrome lined barrel, claw extractor, and blade ejector.

If it were $800 less, that is another story.
I am not saying the 700 or 10/110 actions are bad. I love my Savages and am building another one in 6.5 Creedmoor right now.

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flyingirish04
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Re: FN SPR

Post by flyingirish04 » 11 May 2013, 15:14

srt-4_jon wrote:
flyingirish04 wrote:Listen, I know you like the gun, but you aren't even playing on the same field here. The Mod70 variant action isn't utilized really at all by LE/MIL. I will say Gunny Hathcock way back in 'Nam used a great pre-64 Mod 70 in 30.06. But back then USMC Sniper course was an in country 3 week course, and through the years everything has changed, including the firearm.Both of us are military and lets get serious. The mil bases decisions off of cost. The Beretta M9 is a perfect example. The newest assault rifle testing is another example. Not in the snipers case. Sorry. Maybe ammo, but not the rifles. The m24 and M40 are each hand built. You are simply wrong. Fallacy of Analogy.

Not to mention the type of gun you are talking about is available in a variety of options and methods for less than the FN. And don't take my word for it, take the market's word.

A few items for your consideration:

The positive feed and claw extractor on the Mod 70 is theoretically less prone to misfeeds, in reality, numerous shooter will tell you that isn't the case. Most african safari rifles use the M70 because of the CRF and claw extractor. Not to mention the catastrophic failure situation where a Mod70 is less safe as the case has less metal around it than other actions, due to the large claw extractor.So a little more gas leaks out where the extractor was? A lot of safari rifles use Mauser style actions, which the Mod 70 is a rip off, and less effective and durable version of. And no doubt the design of positive feed is great if you are working the bolt fast, upside down. But it is a trade off. Accuracy is affected, for sure. And it is actually 50% more likely to have catastrophic failure as compared to the R700.

But the biggest indicator of how far off FN is this: Of all the marksman units I have been around, almost all use some variant built off of a Rem700, with a custom bbl. The rest mostly have full custom actions (all rooted off Rem 700 including the Accuracy International platforms), except one that uses the 110 Savage rifle (they got to use their own rifles there), and another that used the Blaser 93 platform. Bear in mind those include City of Austin SWAT (Shout out to Blue), Escambia Co Sheriff, FL, Santa Rosa Co Sheriff, Flathead Co Sheriff, MT, Yellowstone Co Sheriff, MT, City of Portland SERT, Cass County Sheriff, ND, Burleigh Co Sheriff, ND, Williams Co SWAT, ND, MSP SRT, MN, and also FBI HRT, USSS, and I could go on. That doesn't even include every branch of the military, which uses Rem700 variant (or custom variant) for their mid distance BOLT gun. Some have started transitioning to autos like the OBR by Larue, or the SR-25 (Mk11 to the Navy) by KAC for their mid distance shooters, but bolt guns in 308 are almost always Rem700 derived actions. The tend to be most accurate, easiest to customize, true and blueprint. Have best variety of triggers, BMs, etc, etc. It is the gold standard for precision bolt guns.Many police agencies use Bushmaster ARs. Doesn't make them the best. I agree that the R700 action has WAY more options and gunsmiths that work on them. Again, BOLT GUN. And very few use Bushmasters for mid range precision shooting. YOu are again, wrong.

And 10K is a stretch for any barrel in 308. Even a custom one like a Krieger, Lilja, or Bartlein. Put it this way, I doubt it's throat wouldn't be pretty scorched at 10K.None of those makers use a chrome lined barrel like FN False. Chrome lined barrel means absolutely nothing. It is a gimmick. It adds ZERO life to throat of barrel. You really are embarrassing yourself with that comment. The best barrels in the world for life, and precision are the three I noted above. Completely inane comment.

Mod 16 was the other rifle, and you are correct, it was $650 not $500 my apologies. Same difference. It really isnt the same difference. Did the model 16 come with a McMillian stock, quality DBM, heavy barrel? You are comparing the most expensive FN to one of the cheapest Savages. If FN made a gun with a plastic stock and pencil barrel, it would be significantly cheaper. You need to compare apples to apples. I am, because the quality of the barrels are THE SAME. Heavy barrels, do nothing but stop barrel from heating as quickly, subsequently they also cool slower.

Point is it's a nice rifle, but way overpriced. No need to go that route...unless you want an FN.You dont have to get the top of the line FN. The TSR can be had for much less. Heck, you can even get the SPR A1 for $1250 and that one comes with a McMillian stock. That puts it right in the same price range as the Savage 10 FCP with McMillian stock. Except with the FN, you get a 20MOA base, chrome lined barrel, claw extractor, and blade ejector. Again, nothing special. At all. Again, chrome lined bbls are gimmicks, and are also very common on most modern rifles. I have a 20MOA base for you for $25. We have covered why I don't want the mauser knock off action parts.

If it were $800 less, that is another story.
I am not saying the 700 or 10/110 actions are bad. I love my Savages and am building another one in 6.5 Creedmoor right now. They are actually supreme actions to this one. And 6.5 Creed is nice.
Killed Two Stones with One Bird.

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