5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Reloading info for the 5.7x28mm

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5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 06 Jun 2011, 11:16

This can be the thread just to ramble in - maybe help keep the rambling out of the other places :p Which would be largely my fault :laugh:

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 06 Jun 2011, 11:17

Started work on some subsonics...

Trying AutoComp, WSF, HS-6 and a few others.

I have some preliminary data, but will have some good solid stuff pretty soon...

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by Grantness » 06 Jun 2011, 14:08

Good idea!

Yea, faster powders seem to work well for subsonics. Then again, who was it? 1MoreAugust... is that right? (its been so long! :wall: ) developed some AR57 subsonics using slower powders I believe... :ponder: Maybe someone can dig those up.

The only subsonic loads i've bothered with are for the 45gr Sinterfire (which may or may not equate to a 50gr vmax) and VV N350. They are listed here: viewtopic.php?p=118258#p118258" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

For a gun everyone calls a .22, its pretty hard to actually get it to behave like one :laugh:

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by warlock » 06 Jun 2011, 18:06

I have been reloading for about 27 years and thought I knew what I was doing. My son bought a 5.7 pistol and wanted to know if we could reload for it, sure I said. I have never had such a tough time getting a round tuned to a pistol in my life. Thanks to the help on this sight we have a functioning reload that will cycle the pistol in the summer and the winter time in MT. Thank you all for your help. JW Semper Fi

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by Rapier1772 » 06 Jun 2011, 18:43

Grantness wrote:Then again, who was it? 1MoreAugust... is that right? (its been so long! :wall: )
Close, 1moreaug - I used his as a starting point for some of my loads as well.
Grantness wrote:The only subsonic loads i've bothered with are for the 45gr Sinterfire (which may or may not equate to a 50gr vmax) and VV N350. They are listed here: viewtopic.php?p=118258#p118258" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Those speeds are a tad on the fast side :ponder: But I'll try them with a heavier bullet & see if that makes (enough of) a difference.
Grantness wrote:For a gun everyone calls a .22, its pretty hard to actually get it to behave like one :laugh:
Soooo true

Thanks
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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 06 Jun 2011, 19:23

warlock wrote:Thanks to the help on this sight we have a functioning reload that will cycle the pistol in the summer and the winter time in MT. Thank you all for your help. JW Semper Fi
:laugh: That was the worst part for me intitially - going from an 80 degree day to a -20 degree day and trying to get the darn pistol to reliably cycle!

-----

Subsonic load development in the PS90 is going really well with 55gr FMJ's so far. I have at least 3 suitable powders...

I played with some 68gr Hornady's too - probably too big to stabilize but I couldnt resist - we'll see how it goes :D

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 07 Jun 2011, 20:04

Well I have tried a whole bunch of stuff. I have tons of notes to sort through :laugh:

Some results of my efforts - only the loads that worked well and fit into the proper FPS range. This is by no means all I have tested... I have been playing with 55gr FMJ's and 68gr Match Hollow Points...

PS90 subsonic Info:

--------

3.1grs HS6 / 55gr FMJ || Avg - 1079 fps || SD - 10 fps || N=4

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well

--------

2.6grs WSF / 55gr FMJ || Avg - 1046 fps || SD - 20 fps || N=5

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well

--------

2.5grs AutoComp / 55gr FMJ || 1019 fps || SD - 16 fps || N=5

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well

--------

3.0grs Steel / 55gr FMJ || 1082 fps || SD - N/A || N=1

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well


______________________________________


FsN subsonic Info:

--------

5.5grs Win 296 / 55gr FMJ || Avg - 1049 fps || SD - N/A fps || N=1

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well

--------

3.0grs Steel / 55gr FMJ || Avg - 723 fps || SD - N/A fps || N=1

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well - I need to work my way up the load ladder till i get to around 1050 fps...

--------

3.0grs AutoComp / 68gr HP || Avg - 1044 fps || SD - N/A fps || N=1

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well - I need to work my way up the load ladder till i get to around 1050 fps...

--------

3.0grs WSF / 68gr HP || Avg - 1042 fps || SD - N/A fps || N=1

Subsonic - Just barely cycled the action, but it did. I will have to move up the charge just a bit and see what happens.

--------

Not a bad start into my subsonic trials :D
Last edited by iFire on 18 Jun 2011, 14:57, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by Rapier1772 » 07 Jun 2011, 20:32

By worked well you mean...?
I have some subs that I have been testing & my biggest problem seems to be the keyholes that wont go away (target is only 10yd out). Some loads are better than others but sooner or later they always crop up :wall:

Any keyholes with yours or are you even checking that?
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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by VeTTeMaNC486 » 07 Jun 2011, 21:11

iFire wrote:5.5grs Win 296 / 55gr FMJ || Avg - 1049 fps || SD - N/A fps || N=1

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well
Is this correct? Isn't that the same thing as H110? I have heard that it is not to be used with light/low case fill loads, I am interested in your load here. I have just heard this repeated over and over on the internet, any merit to this? If it works in this subsonic, what would keep it from being used in more powerful loads, other than the burn rate being on the slow side?

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 07 Jun 2011, 21:26

Rapier1772 wrote:By worked well you mean...?
"Cycled the action well" is what i said... meaning: It did not short stroke, no FTE's, did not jam and no FTFTFR's (fail to feed the following round)
Rapier1772 wrote:I have some subs that I have been testing & my biggest problem seems to be the keyholes that wont go away (target is only 10yd out). Some loads are better than others but sooner or later they always crop up :wall:

Any keyholes with yours or are you even checking that?
I only checked a couple so far that were around 1200 fps and they were ok, but I have not checked them all... Now that I have some good numbers I can load up some bigger batches and do some better SD testing as well as some accuracy / keyhole tests.

My main goal so far was getting a load that cycled the action while spitting out the bullet at my target of 1050 fps. The 68 grain load seems interesting - the 68 gr @ 1050 fps yields 167 ft/lbs while the 55 gr @ 1050 fps yields 135 ft/lbs...

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 07 Jun 2011, 21:53

VeTTeMaNC486 wrote:
iFire wrote:5.5grs Win 296 / 55gr FMJ || Avg - 1049 fps || SD - N/A fps || N=1

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well
Is this correct? Isn't that the same thing as H110? I have heard that it is not to be used with light/low case fill loads, I am interested in your load here. I have just heard this repeated over and over on the internet, any merit to this? If it works in this subsonic, what would keep it from being used in more powerful loads, other than the burn rate being on the slow side?
Yes - the data is correct.

In the FsN I have used loads with a 55gr FMJ from 3.0 grs to 6.0 grs all with smooth ejection and a nice smooth ladder climb. 5.5 grs was right at my target speed of ~1050 with good function and smooth recoil.. That is why I posted it. I feel confident with this load.

I will do a whole bunch more testing, but 296 for subsonics in the FsN seems to be working well...

In the PS90, I would not shoot anything under 5.0 grs w/ a 55gr. I tried a 4.0gr/55gr load and the gun jammed up bad. The 6.0-7.0 gr loads w/ 40gr Vmax's I shot so far worked well. However, 296 is not a great choice for the PS90 in general... I see no benefits in using 296 in the PS90 to this point... It is possible, but there are soo many other, better choices...

I can explain a whole lot more if you would like about what keeps it from being used in more powerful loads...
Last edited by iFire on 08 Jun 2011, 04:29, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by VeTTeMaNC486 » 07 Jun 2011, 22:39

iFire wrote:
VeTTeMaNC486 wrote:
iFire wrote:5.5grs Win 296 / 55gr FMJ || Avg - 1049 fps || SD - N/A fps || N=1

Subsonic - Cycled the Action Well
Is this correct? Isn't that the same thing as H110? I have heard that it is not to be used with light/low case fill loads, I am interested in your load here. I have just heard this repeated over and over on the internet, any merit to this? If it works in this subsonic, what would keep it from being used in more powerful loads, other than the burn rate being on the slow side?
Yes - the data is correct.

In the FsN I have used loads with a 55gr FMJ from 3.0 grs to 6.0 grs all with smooth ejection and a nice smooth ladder climb. 5.5 grs was right at my target speed of ~1050 with good function and smooth recoil.. That is why I posted it. I feel confident with this load.

I will do a whole bunch more testing, but 296 for subsonics in the FsN seems to be working well...

In the PS90, I would not shoot anything under 5.0 grs w/ a 55gr. I tried a 4.0gr/55gr load and the gun jammed up bad. The 6.0-7.0 gr loads w/ 55gr FMJ's I shot so far worked well. However, 296 is not a great choice for the PS90 in general... I see no benefits in using 296 in the PS90 to this point... It is possible, but there are soo many other, better choices...

I can explain a whole lot more if you would like about what keeps it from being used in more powerful loads...
That is interesting, as it seems to go against what everyone on the internet says about the powder. I am assuming you are not using a mag primer? What kind of velocities were you getting with the 6-7gr 55gr fmj loads in the ps90? I am interested. You can pm me if you wish as to not hijack the thread anymore than it already is.

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by Rapier1772 » 07 Jun 2011, 22:59

iFire wrote:
Rapier1772 wrote:By worked well you mean...?
"Cycled the action well" is what i said... meaning: It did not short stroke, no FTE's, did not jam and no FTFTFR's (fail to feed the following round)
You said the cycled well part later in your post. If I had assumed that was all you meant by
iFire wrote:only the loads that worked well and fit into the proper FPS range.
then you'd have come up with some other thing to say "I said it worked well didn't I?" :p :p

I don't like assuming what people mean because I am usually wrong about that. My jedi powers do not extend to the internet :laugh:
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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by Grantness » 08 Jun 2011, 03:12

Nice start! That's what I like to see :clap: I assume (you like that Rapier?) keyholing is a bigger problem with the heaviest bullets out of the shortest barrels. Did you mention what kind of primers you were using anywhere in there? I always use small pistol cause its an easy way to shave off ~100fps. Let's also remember that the speed of sound can vary based on temp and other factors...

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 08 Jun 2011, 05:06

VeTTeMaNC486 wrote:You can pm me if you wish as to not hijack the thread anymore than it already is.
PM sent - But just so you know your not hi-jacking - ask anything you want :thumb:
Grantness wrote:Nice start! That's what I like to see :clap: I assume (you like that Rapier?) keyholing is a bigger problem with the heaviest bullets out of the shortest barrels. Did you mention what kind of primers you were using anywhere in there? I always use small pistol cause its an easy way to shave off ~100fps. Let's also remember that the speed of sound can vary based on temp and other factors...
Thanks Grantness - I was using CCI 400's ... Might have to give some small pistol a try ...

We have been having quite a few discussions about 296 it seems - Grant you want to give 296 a try in your FsN and confirm some of the data I have posted since you mentioned you had some? I think if both of us can verify it then it should be good...

my data thus far:

55 gr Hornady FMJ | CCI 400 | Win 296 | 1x brass

3.0 - 565
3.5 - 649
4.0 - 742
4.5 - 877
5.0 - 975
5.5 - 1049
6.0 - 1074

I would not start at 3.0 grs - start at 5.0 grs and test inbetween 5.0-6.0

-----

I know the speed of sound can vary... However, since I shoot in cold weather (down to around 0 degrees F) I want something that in theory works in all my conditions (or close to it) - That is why my target speed is 1050 fps :thumb: And yes I probably could go up to around 1100 in the 60 degree test temps I tested in and hope that I lose speed as it gets colder to account for the lower speed of sound at those temps... But for now 1050 is a decent goal...

From a post of yours:

32 F: 1086 fps
40 F: 1095 fps
50 F: 1106 fps
60 F: 1117 fps
65 F: 1122 fps
70 F: 1128 fps
80 F: 1138 fps
90 F: 1149 fps
100 F: 1159 fps

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 08 Jun 2011, 05:11

Rapier1772 wrote:I don't like assuming what people mean because I am usually wrong about that. My jedi powers do not extend to the internet :laugh:
Jedi powers would be nice everywhere :laugh:

I dont mind the questions, so no need to assume... ask questions, it usually brings clarification for everyone :thumb:

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by Grantness » 08 Jun 2011, 06:03

I actually don't have any 55gr bullets....unless you count the XM193 loaded 556 rounds I have. Theoretically I could pull them, but they're crimped in pretty tight. Next step down are some 52gr Sierra Matchkings I believe...

I CAN split parts of this thread off into a new one if we ever get several pages of good data/discussion on something real specific...

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 08 Jun 2011, 06:36

Yeah if we ever get a bunch of good stuff about a particular topic splitting would be a good idea...

You could try the 52grs bullets - 3 grs makes a difference - but at least you could report your general findings :thumb:

It just seems that their is quite a bit of concern over the 296 - I agree that it is not ideal for full power loads, and I wouldnt recommend it... But in this application - in the FsN for subsonics - I have had good success...

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by Grantness » 08 Jun 2011, 06:54

I'll take your word for it, and be cautious as usual. Like I said, I considered 296 for full power loads in my T/C, but thats a whole new ball game. Actually I might have some 55gr solids, but Im going to need ask permission to use them first. Anyways, they wouldnt behave like FMJ so its sorta pointless...

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Re: 5.7x28 Random Reloading Discussions

Post by iFire » 08 Jun 2011, 06:59

Yeah in the T/C you have no timing to mess around with. That is the hard part in the FsN and the PS90...

I would imagine powders like Enforcer, 296, lil' gun and a bunch of others would be good choices and become very useful in a bolt or T/C configuration :thumb:

Maybe I need to get a T/C or bolt gun to in 5.7 to play with :laugh:

Oh and Grant - I still cant believe you have NO 55grs laying around? Really? :p

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