Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Forum for discussing factory & reloading non-5.7x28mm ammunition.
JoJo
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Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by JoJo » 31 Dec 2011, 09:18

I have a scoped AR15 and lots of Nato 62gr ammo. I will be buying more ammo and I need advice on what type.
My environment is a large city and even in the suburbs 200 yards would be the maximum range. Realistically,
75 yards would be the practical range. I am not a hunter so I am just concerned with self defense. I have read that military ammo is a compromise because we did not wish to appear insensitive.

I will be reloading unless I find a deal. What do you folks recommend?

srt-4_jon
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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by srt-4_jon » 31 Dec 2011, 11:52

id go with somethinng like vmax. everything else will penetrate alot. mil ammo is meant not to expand.

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by toyslr » 31 Dec 2011, 13:04

I run M855 Penetrator in SHTF mags. Give up some accuarcy put it'll get the job done

Buffman
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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by Buffman » 31 Dec 2011, 15:11

75gr BTHP/WC T2, or some of that barrier blind OTM 62gr Federal stuff MK318 Mod O or whatever :)

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by Visceral_Malice » 31 Dec 2011, 15:11

I've read 55gr fmj produce some pretty grievous wounds. They apparently fragment pretty violently at the right velocities and the US military stopped using them because of the potential to violate the Geneva convention. That's what I recall anyway.

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by SeaHawkDriver-B » 31 Dec 2011, 20:13

I dont really think it matters, going down the proverbial BARF rabbit hole of which round is going to do what kind of terminal ballistic tissue damage, vs range, vs accuracy, vs barrier pentration, vs frangibility...etc etc is pointless. In any situation where you're using your 5.56 in a defensive role in an urban environment, you've got BIGGER problems to worry about than some sort of theoretical ideology. You'll be damned lucky just to get a round on target if someone is shooting back at you.. so I'd say:

1) Go with something that reliably cycles
2) Go with something you can hit your target with

But just to play along, I am in the same boat toyslr, general issue military ammo has always been M855, which is what you currnetly have, there is only one 62gr NATO round, and thats it. Its green-tipped, and I've shot it in the military for training and standard issue alike. Its never failed me, its not the most accurate, but its cheap and its MILSPEC, and is designed to punch through light body armor or PSGT helmets at intermediate ranges. Only drawback is that you can't use the ammo when shooting steels becuase it tends to ding them up quite badly. 10 mags loaded at all times in a go-bag should be standard.

srt-4_jon
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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by srt-4_jon » 31 Dec 2011, 22:57

fwiw, almost all rifle ammo will penetrate a psgt helmet. the only one i can think of that wont is 22lr. the small 17hm2 and 17hmr will with ease.

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by Oldbindlestiff » 01 Jan 2012, 08:25

M855 is fine for defensive situations and it avoids the "You created special killer ammunition." liabilities if you end up in court. You could try the DRT stuff for soft targets.
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JoJo
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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by JoJo » 01 Jan 2012, 11:15

SeaHawkDriver-B wrote:I dont really think it matters, going down the proverbial BARF rabbit hole of which round is going to do what kind of terminal ballistic tissue damage, vs range, vs accuracy, vs barrier pentration, vs frangibility...etc etc is pointless. In any situation where you're using your 5.56 in a defensive role in an urban environment, you've got BIGGER problems to worry about than some sort of theoretical ideology. You'll be damned lucky just to get a round on target if someone is shooting back at you.. so I'd say:

1) Go with something that reliably cycles
2) Go with something you can hit your target with

But just to play along, I am in the same boat toyslr, general issue military ammo has always been M855, which is what you currnetly have, there is only one 62gr NATO round, and thats it. Its green-tipped, and I've shot it in the military for training and standard issue alike. Its never failed me, its not the most accurate, but its cheap and its MILSPEC, and is designed to punch through light body armor or PSGT helmets at intermediate ranges. Only drawback is that you can't use the ammo when shooting steels becuase it tends to ding them up quite badly. 10 mags loaded at all times in a go-bag should be standard.
I am not completely sure what ammo I have but I have a lot of it! It is stamped "RORG 89" and has the Nato symbol but NO green tip. I pulled the bullet and it weighed 62gr. No problems with shooting it.
Last edited by JoJo on 01 Jan 2012, 11:33, edited 1 time in total.

JoJo
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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by JoJo » 01 Jan 2012, 11:31

Interesting answers but I still have to make a decision.

1. Less than 100 yards
2. Non-professional adversary....no body armor
3. Not concerned with over penetration....outdoor use
4. Reloadable

What 223 round would you most prefer NOT to be shot with! Some of you vets probably know this stuff from hands on experience.
By the way, my barrel has a 1/9 twist.

Thanks

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by flyingirish04 » 01 Jan 2012, 13:11

JoJo, Any 5.56 will work for what you want as long as it is brass cased.

The best is civlian version of the Mk 262 MOD 0 or 1. They both use HPBT 77 grainers loaded up by Black Hills. The MOD 0 uses SMK and the MOD 1 uses the new Nosler HPBT that Black Hills had them design.
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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by Cyberfly » 01 Jan 2012, 14:23

I was going to be a smart aleck and say the most lethal is the one that is fired at me...and missed. Cuz that is going to get the gates of Hades opened and the hounds unleashed on whoever fired the shot.
But since you are looking for serious answers, I'd listen to Irish this time. Seahawkdriver has some very valid points, too. You're going to need your ammo to reliably cycle and be something that you can hit your target with consistantly. Other than that, I think the bullet type and weight and fps really will be secondary. If you are able to hit the target in a SHTF situation, your job is done. Cost can and probably should be a factor as well. If you are seriously going to train yourself to the point that your weapon and muscle memory is so finely tuned that you will need the same ammunition, then cost will become an issue. Trust me on that one (Irish knows what I'm talking about here...its one thing if the government is supplying it, another if you're paying for it yourself).
All things to consider.
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JoJo
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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by JoJo » 02 Jan 2012, 09:27

Thanks everyone. I think I have enough info now to make an informed decision.

Now, what is the best strap system for walking with an Ar15!!!!!!......and the list goes on

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by toyslr » 02 Jan 2012, 09:51

What 223 round would you most prefer NOT to be shot with!

NONE of them....

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by FNtacticalNUT » 02 Jan 2012, 14:34

PMC XTAC all the way baby
AIM Surplus for $289.50 per 1000 rounds
Can't beat it
BOTTOM LINE Cause Stone Cold said so!!!!!!
Last edited by FNtacticalNUT on 27 Jan 2012, 14:24, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by Eliga24 » 07 Jan 2012, 00:51

I've been shooting whatever though my AR.

I want to stock up on ammo for SHTF. I want the most lethal rounds possible. Also I want to try to avoid collateral damage for home defense (less of an issue after full blown SHTF) so some rounds that don't penetrate walls much would be ideal. I don't know much about any rounds besides the M855 and the M193 (I currently have these by American Eagle), so I don't know about HP/SP or any or bullets designed to cause mayhem within the body for the AR, nor do I know about bullets designed for less penetration.

Also I'd like to hear your thoughts on M855 rounds for armored enemies and if its worth having.

I have a 1:9 twist by the way.

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by flyingirish04 » 07 Jan 2012, 11:49

M855 is ok, but it isn't some amazing go through anything round, especially out of carbine length barrels. That is why many US military units are using the SOPMOD 77 grainers. Out of the m4s and Mk 18' they have better energy transfer on target close range and out of our mk12s, it is much better for longer shots because of it's superior BC and larger mass to fight bullet drop and wind drift respectively.
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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by Thedirtyheat » 07 Jan 2012, 12:02

To answer the sling question there isn't a best. It's just all preference and what you are most comfy with really. Everyone has different likes

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by Captan Harold D » 08 Jan 2012, 08:28

Where can one purchase the sopmod 77 grainers?

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Re: Most lethal 223/5.56 ?

Post by flyingirish04 » 08 Jan 2012, 11:33

Blackhills Ammunition sells it. Its their 77gr SMK or Nosler HPBT. Not sure if the civilian version has switched yet, but both projectiles are very, very similar.
Last edited by flyingirish04 on 08 Jan 2012, 15:25, edited 1 time in total.
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