Appleseed Shoot

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f3rr37
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Appleseed Shoot

Post by f3rr37 » 20 Feb 2009, 14:26

Anyone ever been to an Appleseed Shoot?

http://www.appleseedinfo.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There is one coming up here at the end of March and was wondering if it was worth going?

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by Esteves » 20 Feb 2009, 15:59

I've never been, but I like the concept.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by f3rr37 » 20 Feb 2009, 16:00

I was thinking about maybe taking my wife along since women get to go for free. She could make it my birthday present (29th) :D

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by jmz5 » 20 Feb 2009, 18:57

Looks like fun!
كاف

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by MANSKER » 22 Feb 2009, 16:31

Yes I have been-
Did not know what I didn't know about our American heritage and/or about accurate shooting until I did!
Was great time-learned lots-picked up some superb training and made several new friends.
Very good idea taking the wife-doubles your firepower. Any kids-they shoot free also-if under 21.
Just a good experience-enjoy yourself.
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Btw-the web site at rwva.com will give you a lot of info to help you prepare and get more out of your experience.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by jmz5 » 22 Feb 2009, 17:17

Welcome to the forum. :)

Friendly tip - All caps doesnt make for easy reading.
كاف

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by f3rr37 » 23 Feb 2009, 10:04

Welcome Mansker, thanks for the information :)

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 04 Apr 2009, 16:33

f3rr37 wrote:Anyone ever been to an Appleseed Shoot?

http://www.appleseedinfo.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There is one coming up here at the end of March and was wondering if it was worth going?
I'm headed to one April 18-19 (Stinson, WV). Will be taking the AR-57 and PS-90. A co-worker is taking a few .22 rifles. Do you make it to the one last month Fuzzy?

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by f3rr37 » 04 Apr 2009, 20:26

Nah I didn't make it :( It was during the weekend of my birthday and my wife already had plans.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by romer522 » 04 Apr 2009, 21:38

I am thinking about hitting one up later this year, haven't decided what gun i might want to use yet though.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 05 Apr 2009, 06:45

I am going to one over Memorial Day weekend. It is a 3 day event instead of the normal 2 days. Both of my parents, 2 of my sisters, and my 3 brothers are all going. We are all shooting .22lr for cost effectiveness. My dad and I have build several 10/22's in to Liberty Training Rifles for this event.

A Liberty Training Rifle is a 10/22 with M1 style sights and a USGI sling. They look similar to this:

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by dawgfan » 06 Apr 2009, 12:57

I've never been to one, but I've heard a lot about them and it was all extremely favorable. In fact, I've never heard so much as a single negative word about them. Let us know what you think after you go. :guns:

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 06 Apr 2009, 16:15

Will do!

Taking 6 or 8 types of ammo to sight in the rifles on Friday.

Any tips on highly accurate ammo that is available in bulk packs?

We are going to try out CCI Blazer for the first time; I have heard good reports about it.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 06 Apr 2009, 16:52

For the .22L, we will be shooting CCI Mini-Mag.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by User42 » 12 Apr 2009, 13:00

CCI blazer 9mm smells kinda funny. That's all I can really report on that.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 12 Apr 2009, 18:26

CCI Blazer 22lr worked great out of my 10/22. It would jam about one time per mag on 2 of my dad's :( Failure to eject. The empty case would stovepipe, and when the mag was dropped, there was a loose live round...

ETA: Here is a group of CCI blazer out on my 10/22. Range was 25 meters (82 feet). My 10/22 is the base $199 walmart special. I added some VQ trigger goodies and Tech-Sights irons. This is not too bad for a brand new rifle and a stiff crosswind:

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 19 Apr 2009, 18:33

Long weekend. The whole event was a bit interesting. Somehow today I managed to get a 215 on the AQT, so I got a Rifleman patch on my first attendance (using a scoped Savage .22L Bolt Action).

Funny, as how the only other person to get one was a co-worker who talked me into going. He was very modest, and shot quarter to nickel sized groups (he scored 246).

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 20 Apr 2009, 05:24

Good Job!

I am going to be using Irons. I think that the scope at 25M makes it a little easy...
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 20 Apr 2009, 06:00

True, but I think using the bolt action partially made up for it. The stock was a bit short for me making it a bit tough to hold my natural point of aim. I just about exceeded the time limit for stage 2.

Also, looking at the target, I think the instructor graded me with the .30 cal rule. I would have given myself a 212.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by flyingirish04 » 20 Apr 2009, 08:48

Scope at 25 m with a 22 is in fact way to easy. I can usually group 6 out of 6 everytime.

I would use the irons as well.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 20 Apr 2009, 12:52

So, you are saying I should turn the Rifleman patch back in since I don't deserve it?

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by romer522 » 20 Apr 2009, 12:58

I would probably go scoped for an appleseed. Not because i wouldn't like to shoot irons better but i that i may as well use the exact same setup i am likely to use if i ever need to hit somebody at 500 yards. It's gonna take an act of God for me not to have a gun with an optic on it.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 20 Apr 2009, 13:48

Here is an image of a scored target. I know I am not the best shot, and I certainly need to improve. Perhaps I will attend another one down the road, and order some targets from Fred's for practice.

This target is shot at 25 meters (82 feet), quarter shown for scale. It is harder than you might think, but I am a newb whom has had zero training.

Yes, the standing drill was really bad on my part. I offer no excuse.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by Palindari » 20 Apr 2009, 14:52

Gotta look into this... sounds fun :D

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by User42 » 08 May 2009, 22:22

Well if it makes you feel any better, your scored target is a real self esteem booster for me. :laugh:
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 09 May 2009, 05:05

Ok, what are the 4 stages? I know standing, sitting, and prone, but you have 4 different size targets there... What is the posture for each?
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 09 May 2009, 05:17

Standing - 10 rounds - 2 minutes
Standing to Sitting - 10 rounds w/ magazine change - 50 seconds
Standing to Prone - 10 rounds w/ magazine change - 60 seconds
Prone - 10 rounds - 5 minutes

Oh, and considering I was using a savage bolt action, those with semi-auto sure as hell better do better than I did :)

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by User42 » 09 May 2009, 15:22

Yea my first thought was a bolt action would be better for that type of event, but 25 yards? I would feel fine bringing my AK.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by mickey223 » 09 May 2009, 17:13

Appleseeds are really a fun time.

Their logic of training follow's the Riflemans quarter mile, meaning hitting a man sized target at 500 yards with any battle rifle with any ammo and open sights, going back to the american revolution days.

For the first day of the event, go with a semi 22, most will use a 10/22 with techsights. For the second day, any rifle will be fine. Most shoots are 25 yards using scaled targets, depending on the range.

Lots of info on the appleseed site, and Fredsm14stocks http://www.fredsm14stocks.com/catalog/acc.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

has an instructors packet for $35 which is reall good.

It made me start training with 1inch squares at 25 yards, and I plan to set a 20x20 gong target up at 500 yards this summer.

The goal is not sub moa shooting, but more fast accurate mansized hits and engaging targets at greater distances up to 500 yards with iron sights.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 09 May 2009, 18:13

User42 wrote:Yea my first thought was a bolt action would be better for that type of event, but 25 yards? I would feel fine bringing my AK.
Simple challenge then:

Let's see them scored targets, and resulting rifleman patch ;)

Until you actually do it, you really will not have a sense for how difficult it is to shoot on someone else's terms. I really have no appreciation for the comment about the AK, or perhaps I have a poor sense of humor. A bolt action is actually harder because you are slower, and you risk messing with your natural point of aim. I felt it was a challenge, and I was there to learn.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by blueorison » 09 May 2009, 23:56

I compete in NRA intercollegiate with very competitive schools; I personally (we use .22 in our Pardinis, and I've tested many different makes and grains) use Fiocchi. I shot against A&M in a match and they use Federal.

CCI minimag runs hot with a copper wash in rifles, but it groups ok if you're shooting 100 yds~.

My favourite ammo hands-down for NRA competition shooting is Dynamit Nobel. Btw, I'm the pistol captain for my college.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by User42 » 10 May 2009, 17:50

If it makes you feel any better, its not a "minute of man" ak74. I have no problem popping clays as fast as I can aim at 100 yards.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 10 May 2009, 19:57

User42 wrote:If it makes you feel any better, its not a "minute of man" ak74. I have no problem popping clays as fast as I can aim at 100 yards.
No. It would appear that you are likely in the service, and you presumably work with firearms for a living.

First, and foremost, I want to thank you for your service!

I will say though, the posts above feel like an insult to my attempts to learn, from someone whom has learned professionally. The "if it makes you feel any better" jabs actually make me turn red. I am certainly up for constructive criticism if anything can be interpreted from the results above.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by User42 » 10 May 2009, 20:59

Half right, but I don't work with firearms for a living. Technically I'm not even qualified with the weapons we have, too many others are higher priority for the training. My job keeps me too preoccupied to be standing security watches, and too many others don't want to stand those watches so they skimp on the training in attempt to avoid it.

That wasn't 1/2" groups (for the most part), but you definitely shouldn't be ashamed of it. Honestly I don't know how people get tiny groups without benchresting, and I have never been patient enough to attempt to put two bullets through the same hole. I shoot clays because they are more fun, and my vision isn't good enough to see a .22 caliber hole at 50 yards (yea I know they have spotting scopes, but I would rather see the round hit, than stop and check). That, and people tend to leave many more clays than they can hit.

I apologize if you felt that was an insult. If I wanted to insult you, better believe I would want to be well out of range of even that little .22 before I did so. I can count 10 holes in each stage of that target, nothing to be scoffed at. I said your target was a self esteem booster because I was playing with my AK's iron sights a few days before, and now that I know the target and scoring, I'm pretty positive I could earn the same badge. I wasn't saying that you shouldn't have earned it.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 10 May 2009, 21:24

No harm at all, and no need to clarify. If I were in your shoes, they would never let me step out of the SCIF I would certainly be forced to work in.

In many ways, I want to provoke folks to go shoot and post the results. I want to understand if this is any form of a challenge for others. My vision is not the greatest either, and the targets were pretty tough for me. On the standing part, I had a piece of brass from another shooters rifle fly down my back, then progressing down into my boxers. Just an unwarranted distraction where you never know what will happen ;)

My co-worker used to shoot competitively, and it showed with his 242 (out of 250). We were the only ones that received a "rifleman" score out of all the attendees. I'm looking forward to learning more, and giving it another shot.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by blueorison » 12 May 2009, 21:42

oops sorry! I was answering in reference to this post on the .22 ammo
bobapunk wrote:Will do!

Taking 6 or 8 types of ammo to sight in the rifles on Friday.

Any tips on highly accurate ammo that is available in bulk packs?

We are going to try out CCI Blazer for the first time; I have heard good reports about it.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by moreland281 » 13 May 2009, 16:24

Cool

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 27 May 2009, 20:58

Some pics of my achievement!

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 27 May 2009, 21:16

Cool :) A tiny bit more challenging than it looks... My coworker went to another this weekend. He is considering becoming an instructor.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by blueorison » 27 May 2009, 21:24

How many yards is this at; with iron sights or using your reflex sights?

thanks :)
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 27 May 2009, 21:38

25 meters (82 feet)

The targets are scaled so that they represent an AQT at 100yd 200yd 300yd and 400yd.

I shot with Irons all weekend. The EOTech is sighted in for 300 meters and I didn't feel like adjusting it.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by tejohnson » 13 Sep 2009, 20:28

Cool weekend at another Appleseed in Athens, Ohio. Shot a little .22 I built, and made some improvements to the rifles, and more importantly, myself. We had quite a crew of instructors. Friend of mine shot a perfect 250. Wish I could say the same...

"The Guy" from Illinois even came over. I was pretty lucky to have him work with me and my FNAR. First time I shot it without a bipod, and sling only.

Fun with the HBAR.

One thing that we realized is that wrapping your thumb around the pistol grip probably isn't the greatest thing with this gun. Try putting your thumb on the same side as your trigger finger up on the receiver, keeping the trigger finger pad of your paw (hand) away from the grip. The other thing that blows is the rail should be longer on the bottom side of the hand guard. This would allow a hand stop to be used to make NPOA much easier to obtain.

Shot my Noveske lower with the AR-57 upper. Pretty sweet groups, magazine is a PITA to change out quickly.

Figured I would diversify since the techniques that are taught should allow you to shoot well with any rifle. Suppose I put it to the test this weekend....

If you have not been to one yet, you should certainly try to get out to one. It is something you could take your family too and have a pretty good time.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by f3rr37 » 13 Sep 2009, 21:33

Sounds like you had a great time... will definitely try to hit one up if there is another one around here.

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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 14 Sep 2009, 05:47

LOL, The Guy was the Shoot Boss as the Appleseed that I went to on Labor Day Weekend!

He is a great guy!
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by Rapier1772 » 18 May 2013, 21:39

So I just did the first day of this weekend's appleseed shoot. I got worse. Seriously.

I started the day able to hit anything they had us put up but was doing it my way. By the end of the day, with going through all of their steps and trying to listen to the coaches, I couldn't even finish or put the bullets where they were supposed to go.

They did have a couple of good pointers which I will practice from now on but so far, I'm not really impressed. I will let you know tomorrow if it was worth the time & money.

On the plus side, I did get my rifle worked on. 10/22 Takedown has a new trigger & mag release but he couldn't get the auto bolt release to work. He couldn't see why it wouldn't work but we had to put the original back in just to get it to release at all. I thought he had totally broke my rifle there for a bit. Maybe the Takedown uses a different bolt release?
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by blueorison » 19 May 2013, 00:13

We have them at our private range. I've never been.

Then again, I have never been to a shooting class/training. Not that I think I'm beyond learning; I think I have a metric tonne to learn... about everything. They just never get me excited because I fear I get boring teachers.

I think a challenging course would be great to go to; one that allowed me to venture the outdoors and use practical skills and shooting skills... I don't have the resources to do so, right now, that's all.

Keep us updated, D!
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by jgreenberg01 » 19 May 2013, 04:26

As far as I know the 10/22 uses the same bolt release. I was able to make it auto release by using a dremel to modify it. It stuck for a while until I realized that I had inadvertently missed some of the metal filings when I cleaned it. After that it worked great.

I know it's relatively expensive, especially compared to the price of the gun, but the Timney drop-in trigger gives you the auto release, a MUCH improved mag release plus a 4lb trigger. If you don't have an issue with investing the cas, I'm convinced it's the way to go.

Of course YMMV.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 19 May 2013, 04:59

It is not uncommon to see a decline in performance when you try something new/different. It happens in golf, basketball, baseball, shooting...

Just keep practicing!

The first day can be rough and by the end of the day you can get tired and frustrated. Hopefully today you are rested, refreshed, and shooting straight!
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by Rapier1772 » 19 May 2013, 17:53

So day 2 is complete & the best I shot was a 207 (out of 250), just 3 short of getting the Rifleman patch. Weather sucked both days & I was having one problem after another. Even had a squib, luckily I noticed something wasn't right with that shot & it was easy to get out.
But that sling they gave me - AAAAARRRRGGHHH! I hate that thing! :wall: :wall: :wall:
It was more functional for what they were doing than the one I had but it couldn't stay put.
And yes, I will keep practicing. I am even planning on holding "workshops" with ISU's shooting club to get our members familiar with it, maybe some people will want to go to the next one? The instructors were kind enough to give me some extra targets so I'll use them to get club members familiar.
I did have to do a couple of things my way in order to get things to go better but so be it. My way worked better than theirs :p

The history bit was kinda cool, learned some interesting things - like what all school got wrong & how it is kind of similar to some things happening today.

All in all, IMHO - it's worth going to but not at $80. If they can get the price down to $50-$60 then yes, worth it.

Did I mention I hate that damned sling?
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by Rapier1772 » 19 May 2013, 17:58

Oh and the work their guy did on my rifle, put my trigger at 3lb 6.6 ounces. The new mag release he installed also works great. The only problem is the bolt release.
All that only cost me $52. Timneys are $200+ IIRC so I'm good, thanks.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 20 May 2013, 04:03

The Loop Sling will never stay put over a plain cotton tee shirt. That is why competitive high-power shooters use those silly looking shooting jackets! They have padding built into all the right places to make the sling stay put.
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Rapier1772
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by Rapier1772 » 20 May 2013, 04:39

I mean it kept releasing. The position on the arm wasn't a big deal but the clasp used to change the length would release on it's own about 80% of the time. Even had it release while I was shooting a couple of times, needless to say I missed the shot.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by blueorison » 20 May 2013, 09:15

bobapunk wrote:The Loop Sling will never stay put over a plain cotton tee shirt. That is why competitive high-power shooters use those silly looking shooting jackets! They have padding built into all the right places to make the sling stay put.
We loop/bind it around our arm, you don't need a highpower jacket. The jacket is more for rigidity. You can shoot slinged with just a t-shirt on as long as you loop and cause tension.
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by bobapunk » 23 May 2013, 20:18

Blue, yeah you can do it, but in my experience the loop likes to slide down toward your elbow when under tension. The USMC shooting jackets have a pad sewn in the the arm that the sling will slide down to and then stop giving you a very repeatable slug position.

R1772, it sounds like you need a new/better sling!
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Re: Appleseed Shoot

Post by PainKillaX » 23 May 2013, 22:06

bobapunk wrote:Blue, yeah you can do it, but in my experience the loop likes to slide down toward your elbow when under tension. The USMC shooting jackets have a pad sewn in the the arm that the sling will slide down to and then stop giving you a very repeatable slug position.

R1772, it sounds like you need a new/better sling!
In place of padding, we had small bottles of hand sanitizer or mini bibles in the shoulder pockets on our blouses when shooting the slow for part of the range. The last time I shot the range I apparently didn't even rate a legit loop sling and just tied the bastard around my bicep.

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