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I am getting Late Spring Fever and I am in need of a new class III toy. I am having a hard time deciding on what to get :ponder: Both items happen to be in 45 cal

1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M50_Reising" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; or 2. http://www.kriss-tdi.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

1. Wil be a FA or 2, will be an SBR

I can pick up either one but Hmm. :ponder: Kriss is right across the tunnel and the Reising is new and in unfired condition! Crazy Right for an MG to be that old in unfired condition. :clap: The Kriss SBR out the door is 1800 with the tax stamp and the Reising is 3900 out the door with the stamp. :ponder: Both look really fun New technology or old collectable fire power? The Reising I know is worth over 4900 and is never going to go anything up in price but I love to play with my toys. Whisky Tango Foxtrot should I do?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nMYonO8 ... re=related" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnKd6iXHTQg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Confused in Va, Bones

Read about the reliability problems with the kriss

I have heard of none! Jason a good friend of mine helped develop the system. I have even had a chance to fire the FA platform. What problems are you speaking of? If you have heard of anything Negative please share it with me since I am not going to make up my ming until Thursday when I drop some cash on one or the other

I did hours of research earlier this year on the Kriss because I was dead set on buying on with my tax refund. I ended up going with the FS2000 only because of the price was better, but I'll go through what I found.

Initially the Kriss had a lot of issue with faulty ejectors and would jam up frequently and by frequently I mean 1 in 6 rounds or so. Apparently a lot of them got out of the factory with improperly heat treated ejectors. This issue was fixed early on, but there were still a lot of reports of issues with the ejector and it was something strange with the bolt face. The engineers did a slight redesign on the whole bolt and those started shipping spring/summer of 2010 and from what I read, they work flawlessly. So even if its not one of them from that time period, you should be able to send it in to TDI and have it fixed for good. With any platform that is that radically different, you are going to have to expect bugs initially. They worked them out in a pretty timely manner IMO.

Getting an SBR for that price is a great deal, but the collectability of the M50 would be a hard deal to pass up. Just get both and give us some good range reports :thumb: .

I like the idea of the Kriss but I have also heard of reliability issues. Impact Guns in Ogden, UT has one for rent at their indoor range. According to them, it is VERY picky about ammo & jams frequently.

I'd call them & ask, their number is on the page - http://www.impactguns.com/store-locations.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Probably should ask to speak to whomever is running the range desk at the time as that person would likely be more familiar with the Kriss than the salespeople.

But like Visceral said - an SBR'd Kriss for that price is a pretty good deal :thumb: As ugly as they are :laugh: I would still probably risk it :thumb:

KRISS is a train wreck. I have seen two demos where they never worked. I have also talked to many other people who have had the same experience.

Kriss is the gun worlds version of the The Vector Auto.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vector_Motors" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Looks cool, inventor can talk a crap load of BS, get's people to put money down, and never lives up to the hype.

Plus what's knew about it? It is a hi tech modern copy of a Borchardt C-93 pistol.

panzermk2 wrote:Plus what's knew about it?

Well to get technical nothing and everything. What's new about any invention let alone a firearm? They are all built off previous ideas with alterations and design tweaks.

The recoil system, which obviously TDI didn't create, was successfully implemented and works well.

The over design and the way the force is absorbed into the operator. The FCG being behind the barrel is a very different and radical design and gives it most of its bizarre look. Its keeps the force moving directly back, so it technically has a nonexistent bore axis. That is my single favorite design point.

Overall, they managed to keep the internals fairly simplistic and easy to field strip.

Yeah it got off to a rocky start and yes it is definitely overpriced. Does that mean it should be completely dismissed as a terrible product? I don't think it should, but thats just me. Supposedly the XD when it started in Croatia as the HS 2000 it was a complete piece of crap, but look at what it evolved into. I think TDI takes risks and I can appreciate that. It was a bad design flaw, but if they are working hard to fix it, I don't feel they should be completely shunned because of that.

Just my 2 cents.

Sorry to sort of derail the thread btw.

Personally I don't like the kriss. Unreliable is an understatement.

Buy the Reising while you have the chance. You never know when you'll get another chance like that.

I rented one at a range, they had two. The one I rented was really dirty and it jamed. I took it back to counter and they swaped it with the other one and it ran perfect for 100-150 rounds or so. Not sure if it was because it was dirty or if it was because it was a piece of crap, but in its defense it appears that that range does not clean any of the range guns. They have like 10 glocks for rent and the first inch or so of the slide behind (and including) the muzzle is white. I liked it but I do not see the point unless it is SBR'ed, even then, with semi only, its just a pistol with a stock, other than the awesome factor. I'm one of the wierd ones that thinks it looks sick (in a good way).

I'd go with the M50. Like you said, the price will only go up. No more supply. It's a closed bolt select fire, so I betcha it will heat up quick on FA :furious: Funny, this is one gun I simply had never heard about until you brought it up

I started the process already and it not with the KRISS. They do have some issues as I went over there last week. The fired all the staff and have started over on that system. I will be picking up the old tried and true USMC F/A 45!

I think you made a good decision on the M50 FA. That's what I would have done too.

As far as the Kriss is concerned, I just put another 100 rounds through my Kriss pistol at the range today with no problems at all. I've heard of tons of problems with the originals and the range I'm a member of doesn't even rent their's out anymore. It's looking like the problems may be taken care of with the new ones. The range master that I let shoot it was about as impressed with it as he was with my PS90 I let him shoot. I'm going to put about 100 rounds through mine each weekend for a while. If it continues to do really well, I'll SBR it.

I'll keep you updated in case you think you still may want to go with a Kriss in the future. I think it's rather fun to shoot, and after looking at my target, I sure wouldn't want to be down range of it. Nice, big, ragged hole. To each their own though.

Personal opinion is purchase a UMP

Update on the Kriss:

Another 100 rounds through it yesterday at the range. About half of it was rapid fire. No jams or problems.

What ammo were you using? Was it different kinds or at least different than the kind used before?

It's an unusual enough platform that I would still consider getting it - IF the kinks are worked out. Although I would prefer the MP7 first :laugh:

American Eagle 230 grain FMJ 2 weeks ago and Independence 230 grain FMJ Saturday. I have a couple boxes of 5-6 year old WWB I found in the back of one of the cabinets yesterday that I'm thinking about running through it. In my experience, if it chokes on anything, that will be it.

I bought a KRISS about a year ago. The first time I took it to the range I fired 400 rounds through it. 100 in Blazer aluminum crap and it fte or ftf at least once every magazine. Next went 100 rounds American Eagle, no problems at all. Next was 200 rounds of wolf and again no problems at all.
I had heard they had reliability problems when they first came out but have not heard of any on the new ones, but I also have not done a lot of research since I got mine.

Personally I dont like guns that look like dustbusters. The gun looks like a completely unnecessary design, with plastic where it doesn't even need plastic, just for the sake of appeasing some artist's concept... and I'm a Glock guy, so go figure.

That being said I have no idea how it functions, good luck with it if you buy it.

I own an HK UMP.45 SBR, its a decent weapon with great functionality and reliability, although the UMP is a polymer design that isn't nearly as robust as the metal-framed MP5 it was supposed to replace. Its also about 30% larger that it probably needs to be, compared to my other SMG's its the biggest, and borderline unweildy for a .45 SMG or carbine.

I will not be purchasing another carbine or smg in .45. I dont see a whole lot of use for them. Range toy... sure; Uses same type ammo as my pistols... sure, but that where it ends. My FNP 45 pistols pack 15 round magazines, have 5.3" barrels for pretty fantastic velocities, function flawlessly, and come standard with co-witness night sights for a reflex mount. If I'm going to fill both of my hands with a long gun, then i'm wasting my time with a .45 SMG, like the Kriss or the UMP. An SBR in 5.56, or even better an SBR in .300AAC can potentially be just as compact with much more devistating firepower and considerbly enhanced accuracy.

I'm sure .45 SMGs have their uses, but its just not something I'm going to spend money on. If I were you i'd invest in something you knew you were going to reach for if the SHTF... I dont think our country has too much time left before you might need it, and toting around range toys in your gun safe is a waste of money these days.

SeaHawkDriver-B wrote:gure.

That being said I have no idea how it functions, good luck with it if you buy it.

It is a copy of the Borchardt C-93. Replace the flat coiled spring in the hump with a standard coil spring and you have a Kriss.

SeaHawkDriver-B wrote:Personally I dont like guns that look like dustbusters. The gun looks like a completely unnecessary design, with plastic where it doesn't even need plastic, just for the sake of appeasing some artist's concept... and I'm a Glock guy, so go figure.

That being said I have no idea how it functions, good luck with it if you buy it.

Look into the design and you will see why it looks like that. The whole point of the gun is very reduced muzzle rise from a FA 45 SMG. The bolt doesnt blow straight back, it goes back and down to accomplish that. In non FA form, it is just like any other civi SMG clone in a pistol caliber, a fun gun that looks like the real thing.

For those of you who have never seen it, this is the prototype of the kriss. This is just the purely functional, guts of the gun. Maybe now you can see why there is so much plastic on this gun :laugh:

I have been thinking picking up a Kriss SBR, but have had trouble finding the high capacity Glock 21 Magazines. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance. :thumb:

glock dosnt make the mags. kriss does.

Thanks. I'll check with them.

I picked up a Kriss Super V CRB for $1750 yesterday and plan to convert to SBR in 4-6 months when Class 3 papers come through. Put 350 rounds through it without any problems. Half Magtech 230 gr. FMJ and half Walmart Federal. With magnified EoTech sight 3inch groupings at 100 yards. Much less recoil than my 9 mm Colt AR 15. This innovative system works after early production problems, so worth a look for those of you who might be interested. :thumb: