Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sights.

Discuss the FN Handgun lineup; the High Power, FNP, and FNX line.
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africa1
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Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sights.

Post by africa1 » 08 Feb 2012, 18:25

Bought this gun, all black, a short time ago. I have owned several top shelf .45 auto loaders. I bought this because I like the Five SeveN so much. And what a pleasant surprise. Least amount of felt recoil that I have ever experienced with a .45. Deadly accurate out to 20 meters. Fantastic night sights. And I am thrilled that the gun loads and cycles every piece of crap ammo I could find for it. White box Winchester, reloads purchased at a gun show, FMJ, FN, HP, WC. One failure to feed in first magazine. No issues after that.

This is a truly remarkable firearm. Anyone who buys this weapon will not regret it. I did buy the Trijicon RMR 04. I would recommend other new buyers shoot the gun a bit before buying a sight like this, and then borrow a gun that utilizes the sight as I think it is unnecessary. Regular night sights very clear in day and dark.

smpsmp
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Re: Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sig

Post by smpsmp » 09 Feb 2012, 00:45

I have the battery powered RMR on mine as well. The FNP is very accurate right out of the box. Give it a try at 50 yards sometime, it is very much capable of that.

FNtacticalNUT
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Re: Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sig

Post by FNtacticalNUT » 09 Feb 2012, 12:23

Yes it is capable of that. I have one of mine zeroed in at 50 yards with the RMR sight. Extremely accurate

Deathmaster
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Re: Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sig

Post by Deathmaster » 10 Feb 2012, 11:16

I agree africa. I think I could have lived without the RMR. It is cool and everything but I may use it on my future PS90 and take it off the 45 Tactical.

Snaproll
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Re: Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sig

Post by Snaproll » 06 Jul 2012, 06:43

Well, I just did the same thing... bought an FNP because of my fiveseven.

My favorite gun was a Colt Series 70 I bought new as soon as I turned 21. That was also our house gun, but after 10 years it had more sentimental value and it went into the safe. I wanted something that was higher capacity and bought a 9mm FS92 with tritium night sights. I would really have liked a high capacity 45 but such an animal didn't exist, so I lived with the 9mm. I put one of the first lasers on it, a bulky thing in front of the trigger, and eventually replaced it with a Crimson Trace grip laser. After nearly 20 years the sights were so dim I sent them back to Trijicon to be redone.

When CCW became legal here in Wisconsin I really didn't want to carry the Beretta. I never really warmed up to the gun and didn't want to carry something that heavy. I started shopping around for something light and high capacity and ended up with the fiveseven. I was somewhat apprehensive of the small caliber but figured I'd give it a try. I ended up becoming a believer in the fiveseven from an accuracy standpoint. I found it accurate out to 100 yards with the Fast Fire. Because of the weight, the fiveseven is a great carry gun, but I really think you have to count on accuracy for stopping power with the mouse caliber.

"If I could only find a high capacity but light 45"... the google search brought me to the FNP. Actually the FNX, but for all intents and purposes, it sounds like these things are vaporware, so I got the FNP.

It will be a few days until I can pick the gun up and get to the range, but I'm certainly looking forward to it. I selected the FNP because of the good experiences I've had with the fiveseven. I hope the FNP Tac is a pleasant experience as well.

smpsmp
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Re: Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sig

Post by smpsmp » 06 Jul 2012, 19:28

Snaproll,

You're going to have to be accurate with every handgun no matter what the caliber. I certainly wouldn't consider the FsN a mouse caliber gun cause of the charge, but really every basic pistol round is anemic to any basic rifle round.

Snaproll
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Re: Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sig

Post by Snaproll » 07 Jul 2012, 05:44

Oh I agree you have to be accurate with anything, a hit anywhere with a 22 is far better than a miss with a 44. There is no question that I am far more accurate with the fiveseven than any of my other handguns. I've experimented with rapid followup shots with 45, 380, 9, 25, 357 and the fiveseven at 7 yards. The worst was the 25 noisy cricket, (they were all over the place) and the others were roughly the same with 80% (4 out of 5) on the on the paper and roughly half of those in the kill zone. The fiveseven was by far the best, 100% on the paper and 80% in the kill zone. The fiveseven is an absolute tack driver. Maybe more akin to a sewing machine ;) However...

Somewhere on this forum I read an excellent thread on shot placement and it makes a lot of sense. Shot placement is going to make the fiveseven deadly. There is another thread I read recently that was interesting as well. THis was by a cop who turned into a mortician. From observation, his opinion was that 9mm/380 took multiple hits to incompacitate someone. That critical hits were of course fatal, but smaller calibers than 40 or 45 just didn't do enough damage. Chest shots with these calibers deflected off of bone or clothing and had a harder time penetrating to the vital organs, where a 40 or 45 hit broke through. He made another interesting point, the purpose of bone is to support structure; break the bone and the structure collapses. The obvious implication is shattered limb is going to incompasitate someone faster than shreading flesh.

This is also born out by a friend of mine that was a nurse and combat medic in 'Nam, three tours. He had a lot of experience treating wounds. His opinion was that the 5.56 made far more horrific wounds than the 7.62, but... he was looking at it from a treatment standpoint. He said the 5.56, with the fragmentation made much worse flesh wounds where an AK round would just plow though. That's not to say that a 5.56 couldn't shatter bone, where the AK round would "crack" bone, a solid hit with a 5.56 would "shatter" bone in that area. The conclusion is that the 5.56 makes a makes a much worse wound to treat, but which round incapacitates faster? There are so many variables, and I certainly wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of either but I think an argumnent could be made for the larger caliber ruining somone's day quicker.

The morgue worker also was of the opinion that ballistic gel is a terrible indicator of wound capability. His opinion was that a projectile needed to be traveling at least 2500+ fps to have a temporary wound cavity do enough artery damage to be significant, in other words, a rifle round. He also noted that ballistic gel has no bone to deflect a round or clothing to clog up a hollow point.

Based on his observsations, the fiveseven is not a very effective round when stacked up against the same hit with a 40 or 45. It all comes down with shot placement with the fiveseven, which thankfully, with a little practice, is pretty easy to do. The fiveseven is a great gun, high capacity and light weight, two very important factors from a carry standpoint, and it has the accuracy to make it deadly, but hit for hit, a larger caliber would be prefered.

Now you know my reason for choosing the FNP45 Tactical. I understand it is one of the smoothest shooting 45's for followup shots and the high capacity doesn't hurt. I'm not sure I'd want to run a 5K marathon carrying the FNP, but for a fixed defensive area like the home, I think I'll end up chooing the FNP over the 5.7 but the 5.7 is probably going to stay the primary carry pistol.

Just to round out the discussion, for summer shorts weather I also carry a Walther PPK/S. This is by far the most "accurate" handgun I've ever had. It is a natural pointer with homing bullet capability. It's really funny because the gun is so small and the sight radious is so short, but I can plink gongs with it out to 100 yards with iron sights (once I figure the 3 foot drop at that range). One of the funny things is that the sights are right on, but about 1/16th off from center. The barrel must not be drilled straight in relation to the frame.

My other 'handgun' is interesting. I have a Rock River PDS. I'm not sure how this passed BATF as a handgun, it's basically a short barreled AR-15. It finely threads the line between a SBR and AOW, is legal as a handgun, and technically legal as a CCW. Not something I would normally "carry" but something that is nice to have when camping out in the boonies (where you can hear the strains of banjo music at night if you catch my drift). I used to have an 870 Express for this purpose but is was such a PITA to transport and it had to be cased an unloaded. The PDS can be transported uncased and loaded since it is a pistol. It has a picatinny top so I can run anything from iron sights to a Pulsar day/night vision scope. plus mags from 20 to 100 rounds. Very versitile.

Anyway, on the accuracy thing, the fiveseven seems to be at one end of the spectrum and the FNP Tactical at the other. It's going to be interesting to compare both. As Ripley said, "It's the only way to be sure". :)

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jgreenberg01
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Re: Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sig

Post by jgreenberg01 » 07 Jul 2012, 07:42

I have both the FsN and the FNP-45T (and many others as well). At one point I thought as you did and built the FNP-45T as my primary home defense weapon, complete with suppressor, RMR red dot sight and TLR-2 tac-light. I even carried it for a little over a week (without the suppressor). That was enough and I felt like I was listing to my starboard side after that week+.

Eventually I even stopped using the FNP-45T as my nightstand gun because I realized that I was a better shot with the FsN. Don’t get me wrong – I can hit a gummy bear at 30 feet with either gun – standing still.

But when it comes to moving and shooting – which is what a real-life scenario will likely entail, along with the adrenaline pumping shaking hands – the FsN wins out. Every time.

I’ve also shot various 5.7x28 rounds into ballistic gel, clay and other mediums and feel confident that a few of Elite Ammunition’s rounds will do as much damage (or more in some cases) than a .45acp will do.

As far as accuracy is concerned, check out this competition we have here on the forum because this is what I am referring to with regard to moving and shooting:

viewtopic.php?f=68&t=12877" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

While you’re at it, I invite you to join in – we need more people playing in the reindeer games. Eventually there will be prizes and it’s also a fun training tool in some cases.

:D
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Snaproll
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Re: Just finished playing with 45 Tactical, fixed combat sig

Post by Snaproll » 08 Jul 2012, 04:57

Thanks for the info and the invite. I'm really looking forward to picking up the 45T on Tuesday. I bought it here in Wisconsin and we have a 48 hour "cooling off" period. (Yeah, like I'm going to decide to kill somebody but want to do it with a new gun rather than any of the ones I already own). I bought the gun about 4:15 on Thursday. That means I could pick it up at 4:15 on Saturnday... except the gunshop is only open until 4:00 on Saturday, closed on Sunday and Monday..... Tuesday :( is the earliest :( :( :(

That gun law is so stupid. If I traded in a handgun, I still have to wait the two days to buy a new handgun. Well at least in Wisconsin we don't need to have an FOI (Firearms Owner Identification) card like in Illinois. There was a newspaper guy that every year would send in a photo ID application for people like Al Capone, John Dillinger and other notables and usually got the FOI card for them. I think the only time it was rejected was when he send an application in with a photo ogf his dog.

Here in Wisconsin, since CCW became legal in November, they are STILL processing 2000 applications a week! The state is hiring another 8 or 9 people to catch up on the backlog. Gun sales are slacking off some, but have been huge here.

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